How to balance saving and tackling debt

ALEX ROCA: Hello, and thank you for joining Women Talk Money. My name is Alex Roca and I will be your host for today's conversation. This is our back to school two-part series. Today is lesson 1, focusing on how-tos of financial planning where we'll refresh the fundamentals-- spending, saving, and paying down debt. Then on the 17th, we're going to be covering the basics of investing. Joining us in this essential conversation are Julie Marxen, a workplace financial consultant based in California, and Nehanda Julot, also a workplace financial consultant, but she's based in Chicago. And for the record, the power red was not planned, but I do think it works. Now, in the spirit of back to school, we wanted to take a step back and reacquaint ourselves with the basics. So, as I said earlier, we put together a mini two-part series. Now, whether you're starting fresh or just want to take a minute to refocus, our hope is that you leave this series feeling more confident and excited about your next financial step. Today, for the first session, we'll talk about how to grow your savings and to pay down your debt simultaneously. We have eight steps to share with you all and a few other tips and tricks that can help you organize your financial priorities. Now, if you're anything like me, I like to write everything down, so make it easier on yourself. You can always download the slides and use them as a checklist. And again, next week is all about investing, so be sure that you register for that one, too. OK, we have a lot to cover, so let's get started. Julie, with so many competing priorities, how can we know what to focus on first? Tell us our first step.

 

JULIE MARXEN: Awesome. Thank you, Alex. Well, first, I have to say I absolutely love back to school. It's one of my favorite times of year. It gives me a similar feeling as New Year's, a fresh start and a new beginning.So we're being pulled in so many different directions-- credit cards, car payments, mortgages, student loans, healthcare expenses, just life. It can feel overwhelming and stressful, especially if you're not sure how to best focus your attention. Luckily, though, today, we have a few steps to share with you all that will hopefully take some of the confusion out of the process as you work towards your goals and clarify where you can put your next dollar. The first step is to take actually a step backward and to look at the big picture. As my mom always says, you got to look for the forest through the trees. We want to get organized. I understand this may seem a little bit basic. It can be a bit of a tedious exercise, but it's so important to know what we have and where it's going. There is something that I share with clients and participants that I speak with day in and day out. It's called the four-quadrant exercise. So you can fold a piece of paper or just take a piece of paper and make four quadrants or four rectangles on that piece of paper. And I want you to label each quadrant. The quadrants are labeled as owe, own, earn, spend. So what you owe, own, earn, and spend. When we look at the owe category, what we're talking about is what are our debts, what are the liabilities on our balance sheet, what are the loans that we're still paying down or the mortgage or the car payments Listing those out along with the interest rates associated with what we owe and also the balances that you have left. Knowing what you own, this is the assets part of the balance sheet. What are your real assets? What are your accounts? What are the collectibles that you have? What are you earning? What sort of earned income are you bringing in? Salary, wages, tips, any passive income that you may have come in. And of course, we need to know what the outflows are. What do you spend on a monthly basis? We highly encourage people to categorize their expenses between fixed or essential expenses, as well as any discretionary items. Your fixed expenses are going to be those things like, the mortgage and the insurance payments, food, and things like that. More of the discretionary items could be things like vacation, travel, going out to eat. Highly recommend trying our debt management worksheet, too. This is a great way to help you delineate all of the items that are in the owe category.

 

ALEX ROCA: And Fidelity actually has a great tool to help you do this. It's called Full View. And you can input all of your information digitally and use that as a baseline moving forward. So what do I mean by this? You can actually add your accounts, even the ones held outside of Fidelity, and you'll be able to see your entire financial picture in one place. Once you fill out that information, you'll have access to budgeting tools, debt management dashboards, and so much more. Now Nehanda, how much we should be spending or budgeting for in each of those quadrants that Julie was talking about before?

 

NEHANDA JULOT: Of course. Hello, everyone. And hello, beautiful Women Talk Money community. We'll definitely talk about a guideline to share with you on spending and budgeting. But first and foremost, we want to acknowledge that everyone's situation is different. Costs can vary depending on where you are living. So these are strictly guidelines. And we want to make sure you give yourself grace, have milestones along the way. And that is OK, and we celebrate that. Now in terms of the guideline, we want to share with you today our 50-15-5 guideline. And we're going to break this down for you in three parts that you see here on the screen. The 50% part is really thinking about keeping your budget for essential expenses to more than no more than 50% of your pre-tax income. So think of these as your must-haves, your four walls. I like to think of it as the things that helped me sleep at night. We're judgment-free on whatever gets on that list, whatever is essential for you. The 15% part of this guideline is we suggest allocating 15% of your income to your retirement savings. That includes your workplace plans, like 401(k)s, 403(b)s, or IRAs. And bonus, this 15% number also includes your employer match if that is offered to you. On to the 5% piece of the puzzle here, we suggest allocating 5% of your income to short-term savings, a.k.a. your emergency savings. And I love this part because it's not a matter of if an emergency will happen, but when. So having something in place, an account that's funded to prepare for that rainy day, that hurricane, that monsoon, whatever you want to call it is golden. And not only that, that account is intended to be used for emergencies. So don't be afraid to use it. I have folks that are scared to pull from it. When emergency happens, use it. Every account has a job. And then this 50-15-5, the 5 piece allows you to have a plan in place to replenish it. And not only that, as you can see, the 50-15-5 doesn't equal 100%, that's intentional. We want to give you all a wiggle room, grace room for that 30% to be your want-to-haves. What do you enjoy doing? What is your fun money going to be allocated for? We definitely want to make room in our budget for that to address our desires.

 

ALEX ROCA: And we do love a framework, but you're so right, Nehanda. It's just that a framework. For example, if your situation doesn't allow you to save 15% for retirement right now, that's OK. Start where you can. And like you said, we're here to help you. Let's keep going with that thought for a second. The framework is a great goal. But where should someone start if they're finding it difficult to fit into that framework and feel like they may not have enough to do everything? Julie, can you take this one?

 

JULIE MARXEN: Yes, absolutely. We want to make sure that we're protecting the credit score. What is the credit score? Your credit score is a three-digit number that estimates the likelihood you are to repay a loan in full and on time. Your credit score is derived from a number of different items, such as payment history, debt utilization, length of credit history, again, just to name a few. When we think of your credit score, think about the owe quadrant that I mentioned when we got started today. The debts in your owe quadrant directly impact your credit score. So step 3 is to make sure that you're making all of your minimum payments. This goes without saying, but missed payments can lead to late fees and compounding interest charges. This can cause debt to spiral out of control. If you have trouble staying on top of bill dates, you can consider a few things. Number 1, enroll in autopay. That way, you can make your payments on time automatically. And I would say, with most anything financial-related, whether it's paying down debt, saving, investing, any time that you can automate those things, you are more likely to hold yourself accountable. Register for billing alerts. This can act as a reminder before your payment is due. Or of course, create your own DIY reminder system, either in your calendar, making sure your bill emails stay at the top of your inbox until you pay them. I, for one, put reminders on my phone all the time just letting me I've got a bill that I need to pay.

 

ALEX ROCA: That's a great callout. Maybe we can't do everything right now. The least we can do is make our minimum payments and make them on time. And we can still call this a big win. Nehanda, after making sure we're making all of our minimum payments, what can we do next? What's our step 4?

 

NEHANDA JULOT: Of course, on step 4, we're making sure we get all our steps in today. Once we do our minimum payment obligation, it's time to build that rainy day fund. Build those reserves. So we're talking about that 5% category that I shared earlier today. So we suggest aiming to reach an initial cash buffer of $1,000. Or I would even take it a step further and think about whatever your rent or housing payment is. Now, where I live, It is not $1,000. So I'm aiming for more for that initial cash buffer. But you're doing whatever you can, turning the dial up or down as you see fit. And then once you get to that point, let's ensure that it's not a lump sum that you're doing. Maybe you have to progress along the way and that's OK. That's what that 5% is there. Or if it has to be less because that's what you can manage, that's OK, too. I'm all about baby steps and milestones to these guidelines. Because when a baby first takes its first steps, his or her first steps, we celebrate that. That's monumental. Baby steps should be monumental for us as well, and that should signify progress.

 

ALEX ROCA: That's so smart because you don't when something is going to come up, like car trouble or an unexpected medical bill. Having a little cash set aside can help make sure that your bills are paid on time. And ultimately, that you protect that credit score. Julie was talking about earlier. So, Julie, our minimum payments are being paid and now we have a little cash buffer. What can we turn our attention to next?

 

JULIE MARXEN: So we're going to switch gears slightly to talk about the 15% category of retirement that Nehanda had mentioned with the 50-15-5 rule. So this step, step number 5, may not apply to everyone. However, if you have an employer-sponsored retirement plan, such as a 401(k) or a 403(b), it is time to make sure you're contributing enough to capture your employer match. An employer's match is essentially free money, so not taking advantage of it is like leaving money on the table. We do not want you to do that. With that being said, you want to look into whether your employer's contributions take time to vest and think about whether you'll stay at the job long enough for them to fully vest before you start banking on that free money. Vesting, just so everyone knows, is a term that's used that corresponds to what your employer contributes. And vesting corresponds to how much you have officially earned of your employer's contributions towards your retirement. A lot of times, you can see companies or organizations will offer a three-year cliff vesting. You have to be there a minimum of three years to get the match or five years. So look into that with your employer just to confirm how long does it take to vest or earn the dollars that they've contributed on your behalf. Also, a last note. A lot of employers offer a 1% auto increase program. This is where your contributions would automatically increase by 1% each year. You can put a max on it. So for example, let's say right now you're contributing 5%, and you know you want to get to 10%. You can opt into this program until you reach 10% over the next few years. It's simple. It's easy to do. You probably won't even notice the extra 1% coming out of your paycheck, but that small amount coming out of your paycheck can make a very big difference in the future. There's power in small amounts, and we have a power of small amounts tool here at Fidelity that you can use to visualize your unique situation just by increasing your contribution rate by 1% towards retirement each year. This tool is called The Power of Small Amounts tool.

 

ALEX ROCA: I love that, Julie. I think when we talk about numbers and percentages, it almost doesn't sound real. So 1% of $1,000 is $10. That means that if you make $1,000 per paycheck, when you increase your contributions by 1%, you will be contributing an additional $10. Does that make you feel differently about that 1%? It may be small, but to Julie's point, it can be powerful. That 1% is mighty and can potentially change your future. Now I'm looking through the chat. So before we move on, I want to be balanced. I'm seeing some questions about, hey, what do I do if I don't have an employer retirement plan? Nehanda, what can someone do in this step if an employer retirement plan isn't an option?

 

NEHANDA JULOT: Yes, we want to have options for everyone here. So in that case, you would consider contributing consistently to an IRA that is a Roth or a traditional IRA. And if you need help deciding on which one might be right for you, we're here for you as well. You can definitely take a look at our options there in a tool and resource to help you in that decision. Just like you opt, if you have an employer plan, to have that happen automatically and consistently, we're saying that can also be the case for an IRA. You can set that up to go weekly, monthly, or whatever works for you. Because if you're anything like me, there were hundreds things going on, sometimes our plates are full. So whatever we can do to simplify and automate our finances and help us have one less thing to think about is amazing. And not only do we want to have that sleep at night, we want to sleep peacefully at night. So simplifying finances, automating these contributions is great. If you're not sure what type, there's also a Fidelity IRA Contribution Calculator that can help you think about what you might be contributing. But with these IRAs and with retirement planning as a specific rule of thumb, there are maximums, there are limits. And in terms of the IRAs, traditional IRAs, generally speaking, pre-tax contributions, they go in before they're taxed. And then when they come out, your contributions and your earnings are taxed upon withdrawals. With Roth IRAs, you've already taxed your contributions. They're going in after tax. And then as long as you follow the rules upon withdrawals, everything comes out tax-free, including your earnings. We have a great article that we're going to share with you that is entitled "Seven Commonly Overlooked Facts about IRAs." I love them because they're surprise fun facts about IRAs, such as a spousal IRA. If there's a spouse not earning wages, they can open one provided the other spouse is working and they file jointly. There's IRAs for those who are self-employed and freelancers, and even in Roth IRA for kids. So definitely check out that article for fun facts. Yes, I said the word fun and I IRAs in the same sentence. So definitely take a look at that. And an important call out to IRAs. Putting the money in the IRA and contributing is the first step. Beyond that, it's investing. Getting that money to work harder than you do, as we say here on Women Talk Money. So it's important to think about that. And also, again, as you have milestones toward these guidelines that we're sharing with you, you can bump things up along the way. So you could consider increasing your contributions right as you build that momentum towards your retirement.

 

ALEX ROCA: Absolutely. And saving for your future is so important. So even if you have a workplace retirement account and you want to save in an IRA, you can absolutely do that. Again, saving for your future is so important, especially for us women, because we deal with a lot of different factors, like potentially the pay gap or the fact that we're more likely to take a break from our careers for caregiving duties. And still, after all of that, we tend to pay and put ourselves last. So make sure that if you're able to, that you're saving anywhere and everywhere that you can. So Julie, you know what's coming. We're on step 6. Can you let us know what's next on to-do list?

 

JULIE MARXEN: Yes. Thank you, Alex. So we're at the point that if you're carrying balances on any credit cards, to start chipping away at those by paying more than your minimum monthly payment. If you don't have any outstanding credit card debt and you pay your balances monthly, go ahead and skip number 6 and move on to number 7. But eliminating credit card debt is so important so that you don't get stuck in the high interest rate cycle. I tell folks a lot of times, in our life we have different types of debt. And I characterize debt like cholesterol. We have our good cholesterol and our bad cholesterol. Credit card debt and carrying those balances month over month, it's like the bad cholesterol. That's what we want to try and diminish and lower. If you have balances on more than one card, there's two common strategies to tackle this. The two common strategies are the snowball and the avalanche method. With the snowball method to paying down credit card debt, you start by paying extra on the credit card with the smallest balance until it's paid off. Then move on to the card with the next smallest balance and pay the minimum plus the amount that you were paying on the first card. Continue this method until all of your cards are paid off. The snowball method, the benefit to this is that it really helps build momentum, and it's very satisfying to see zero balances and cross cards off of your to-do list. On the other hand, the avalanche method, you start by paying extra on the card with the highest interest rate until it's paid off. Once that's paid off, you move on to the next card with the next highest interest rate, making the minimum payment plus the amount that you were paying on the first card, and continue this approach until all of your cards are paid off. The benefit to the avalanche method is that you may save money on interest, especially if your cards have a very wide range of interest rates. We have seen that in the last few years where credit card rates of interest are astronomically high, some of them nearing or even meeting 30%. Once your cards are paid off, if you continue to use them, make sure to start paying your balance in full every month. We want to try and avoid that interest rate charge and that interest rate cycle and any potential late or missed payment fees. Not saying not to use credit cards, I know that I do. But we don't want the interest rate cycle to get the best of us.

 

ALEX ROCA: Thank you for covering those, Julie, I know that I've used the snowball method in the past and it works. Now, looking through the chat, we're also getting a couple of questions and comments around not being able to pay credit card bills. Nehanda, if you're in a situation where you're unable to pay your credit card bill and it's due, is there anything we can do?

 

NEHANDA JULOT: Yes, yes, for sure. We want to reassure you and have a conversation around this topic because sometimes it's what can be done. It feels overwhelming. So I know that missing credit card payments is a major strain on your finances, and it can increase a lot of stress. So stop using the card is our first recommendation. If possible, leaving it at home, unlinking it from your digital wallet. I believe it was on another Women Talk Money webinar with one of my colleagues shared putting their credit card in the freezer and then having to defrost it. And in that defrosting time, that was the time that they reflected upon do they really need to put it on their credit card or not. Whatever you have to do to strategically keep that distance from you in the card. And then you want to try to call your credit card issuer. Sometimes we might think that hey, this is it. This is what I have to deal with. But the power that we have, the power to use our voice, call them up. Tell them about your situation. See if you could possibly negotiate a lower interest rate even from a time period. They may say no, but at least you tried and used your voice. The power in that. Not only that, but you could also consider exploring credit counseling. And we do want to make sure you know that if you are speaking to or need to speak to a credit counselor, that relationship will not impact your credit score. It does not mean you're filing for bankruptcy. What it is is a conversation around the best options in terms of debt relief. So we want to make that clear. You can find reputable credit counseling programs through the Department of Justice, US Trustee Program, which features a searchable database of credit counselors. Another option to consider is transferring your balance to a 0% credit card. So consolidating that debt for a single payment and ideally lower interest payments, maybe 0% promotional offer. Now, it's important with this strategy to understand the terms and conditions, the fees, all of the fine print. Ask the credit card company a hundred questions if you need to so you're clear if you decide to go this route.

 

ALEX ROCA: I actually want to jump in here before we get back to the steps. Julie, I have a follow-up question on what Nehanda just said, and then we can get back to step 6. What if the situation isn't as temporary as we'd like, and we're not sure when we're going to be able to pay our credit card bill, what can someone do in that situation?

 

JULIE MARXEN: Well, first and foremost, I think we as women try to tackle everything and take everything on ourselves. I want to tell everyone it is OK to ask for help. And it's encouraged. Finances in general can be extremely difficult to navigate. Consider working with a financial professional so that you have an established relationship in both the good times and the bad times. There is a green button and I think Alex had already mentioned it. But if you click on that green button here in today's webinar, I think it's at the bottom right-hand side of your screen, fill out some personal information, a Fidelity financial professional can and will reach out to you to help walk you through your unique situation. So highly encouraged. But going back to your initial question, what can you do if you can't pay your credit card bills? At first, call your card issuer. They may be willing to negotiate with you. Ask for relief options. If you suspect that you're going to need more than just one waived fee, ask your credit card creditor for more relief options. Could be something as lower minimum payment or even a lower interest rate for a few months until your financial situation stabilizes? Perhaps explore a hardship forbearance program. Your credit card issuer may also provide this program to briefly pause payments in the event of a financial setback. Maybe negotiate a repayment or a debt settlement plan. This, you can negotiate yourself, or with the help of a debt counselor or an attorney. And I think the big thing to take away from these ideas is that it never hurts to just ask. You won't what options are out there for you unless you take the time to do the research and ask and to ask for help. It's absolutely OK.

 

ALEX ROCA: I want to thank you both for sharing this information. And I totally agree. Working with a financial professional can offer a sense of relief, and it can take some of the guesswork out of what to do next. Definitely click on that green button if you have questions. So let's get back on track with our steps here. I think we're on 7. So Nehanda, once our credit cards are all sorted out, if needed, what's next?

 

NEHANDA JULOT: Yes. Remember the cash buffer we've been talking about throughout this webinar. Now it's time to fully fund this emergency savings account. It's go time. So we want to share with you all an article about how to save for emergencies. And not only that, what kind of account should you consider to hold this emergency money in? For this step, we say aim to save at least three to six months of your essential expenses. And a common question I get from clients is where should I be in that three to six month range? First and foremost, as always, it's your comfort level. But you can think about factors such as, do you work in an industry, if you lose your job, it might be hard for you to pick up another one? So maybe you're on the six-month, closer to the six-month range. So factors such as that for your personal situation is what you consider. But your goal again as you inch in progress toward that three to six months, we're talking sleep in the seminar, sleeping peacefully at night. That is what is meant to do to make you feel like you are covered when emergencies come up. We want to make sure that money is also easily accessible. Keeping it in cash, not--and earning interest. We want to earn as much interest as we can along the way. High interest savings account, you could consider money market funds, things that could provide that interest. But we don't want this money invested for there to be ups and downs. So easily accessible. And it may feel like a lot to keep it in cash. But remember, this is your safety net. This is your I'm going to sleep amazing tonight money. That's what it's there for to be there if there's a life curveball that comes along your way.

 

ALEX ROCA: We are flying through this checklist. So credit cards are square. Our emergency savings is fully funded. I think this is also a good spot to bring up a few of the questions from the chat that we actually see quite often. Should someone focus on paying down all of their debt or switch gears and contribute more to saving? Julie, with that in mind, can you take us through our last step?

 

JULIE MARXEN: Yes. I can't believe we're at the last step. Wow, we have flown through this. The good news is you now have many of your most pressing financial needs covered, so you can start moving down your priority list. This may be where decisions start to get a little bit more complex for you and your situation. So if you still have debt, that could be student loans and auto loan, home equity, a mortgage, try comparing the interest rate in your debt to our rule of 6%. What is the rule of 6%? Generally speaking, Fidelity encourages you to focus on paying off debts that have an interest rate of 6% or greater before any additional investing. On the flip side, if the rate of interest on any particular debt is less than 6%, probably makes sense to make the minimum payments and invest simultaneously. That 6% rule can help you decide whether your next priority should be paying more than the minimum on remaining debts or investing additional unmatched dollars toward retirement or other goals. If you do have student loans or mortgage, also make sure that you're taking advantage of maybe any tax deductions that you could be eligible for on the interest that you pay. Explore any employer benefit programs like student loan relief. Or maybe if you work in the public sector, you'll qualify for public service loan forgiveness. As we mentioned earlier, we want to make sure that you are aiming to save that 15% of your income towards retirement each year. Keep in mind, that does include what the employer is contributing on your behalf. That 15% doesn't all fall on you. But just know that this is something that we are aiming for is that 15%. So a guideline on how much to save for retirement may be during step 4, if we go back, you were only contributing enough to get your employer match. Now it's time to try and hit that full 15% mark before you continue down your priority list. And if you're already hitting that 15%, amazing. Consider saving even more, perhaps maxing out your contributions to your employer plan to the IRS limit, or opening a supplemental IRA to potentially save more. It's really about striking that balance between paying off debt, saving, and investing. And I think that 6% rule of thumb really helps give you an idea of what you should be prioritizing.

 

NEHANDA JULOT: I appreciate you sharing that, Julie. I agree. We're continuing up the ladder of financial wellness and with our steps, the decisions, as we get higher and higher up the ladder, can be a little more complex. While we're climbing the ladder, I want to make sure we also take a moment to look down the ladder and see how far we've climbed, because a lot of us, especially as women, are go, go, go, on to the next, myself included. So maybe we add another square on the quadratic what we've accomplished so far, what we're celebrating, what we're proud of. So I want to make sure we make room for that as well. As we've said a few times today, if you aren't already working with a financial professional, this is the time to consider bringing in some help. Definitely leaning on someone who can help you not only identify and prioritize your goal. Sometimes we may need to reprioritize our goals. Things come up, life happens. Having someone to lean on is critical. Having that financial professional that could maybe serve as an accountability partner, someone who collaborates with you and works with you. Not speaking at you, but collaborating with you. And providing that outside reassurance that you're on the right track.

 

ALEX ROCA: Yeah. I have to agree, Nehanda. I would say everyone can benefit from working with a financial professional, no matter what step you're on, because everybody has their expertise. We rely on different people for different things-- a builder for a house, a doctor if you're sick. So establishing a relationship with a financial professional is no different. So now that we have to-do list prioritized, let's expand. Julie, what can we do if we feel tight on cash each month, and someone is trying to work through this prioritized list, but may not have enough, or is looking for a little more?

 

JULIE MARXEN: So it is 2025. There are side hustles everywhere you look and potentially something for everyone. We have a few, 20, to mention side hustle ideas that could bring in some extra cash. I won't go over all 20, but something that you could consider. Selling your old stuff, thrifting can be lucrative. Perhaps you have clothing or shoes or handbags that you're just not utilizing anymore, so you could try selling some of that online. Believe it or not, cleaning. That's actually my love language. I love to clean. I'd be happy to clean someone's house. That could be another side hustle. Delivering food or driving for one of the rideshare apps, proofreading, editing resumes. Hey, becoming a TV or a movie extra. I live in the West Coast near a very big metropolitan city where media is king. And so, that's very common. I have a lot of friends that just serve as extras in commercials. I think the thing with a side hustle is you want to think about what you're already good at, so that you don't have to invest a lot of time learning something new. You shouldn't have to get a PhD for your side hustle. Consider what you just enjoy doing and what you're really good at. Even if you are good at something but you don't enjoy doing it for yourself, odds are you probably won't like doing it for others either. And I think the thing with the side hustle is the juice should be worth the squeeze. Account for what people are willing to pay for in your area upfront and ongoing costs. Before you embark on that side hustle, you want to have a good idea of the level of effort investment that's going to lead to a big enough reward. And once you find that gig, market yourself, tell your friends and family that you're looking for clients. Maybe post in a local social media group as well.

 

ALEX ROCA: That's great, Julie. Thank you for sharing that. We also that not everyone will be able to take a side hustle. So Nehanda, do you have any other tips for someone wanting to save more money, may not have much left over to save, and may also not have the opportunity to necessarily make any more right now?

 

NEHANDA JULOT: Yes. Because as the long list of side hustles does exist, many of us may not have the time to do the extras. So where can we look at our budget? Where can we adjust things in our life? And we have a million things to do. And remember, I'm the one who is encouraging that amazing sleep. So we want to share with you all an article that I love. That's "10 Ways to Cut Your Expenses by 10%." There are a few pointers that I even by heart in that article where it says embrace the art of negotiation, something spoke to earlier. Use your voice. Talk to your credit card issuers. Talk to your utility companies. Can you negotiate rates? There is something in there embracing your inner chef. What's your passion? What are you already good at? Doing that, maybe being that chef instead of going out to eat. Things like that, you could think about in that article will share and give you some ideas. Because it's more than saving, obviously, investing. But how do we minimize expenses, that can also amplify our financial picture. Everyone's situation is different. So there are money-saving mindset. Needing more money, we want to also think of this as abundance. It's not restriction, but how can we think outside of the box, to minimize expenses in our life. We can even be reflecting on the quadrants that Julie shared earlier. And we're seeing our money is going places that isn't aligned with our life anymore. It's not reflecting our values. So definitely take a look at that article, take a look at some of the things I shared with you today. And let's put it in perspective, again, the power of small amounts. Sometimes speaking in big numbers can be overwhelming and unattainable. But if we say $14 a day, just $14 a day, that's what? I don't even know if that's lunch in some parts of the country, you can add an extra $5,000 to your bank account by the end of the year and potentially, again, amplifying your saving and investing for that money if that's a goal.

 

ALEX ROCA: Nehanda, what a perfect segue for next week's events, which again is titled "What You Should about investing. So please join us on the 17th for a deeper dive into how to get started investing. Or if you're already investing, what can you do to level up? Julie, Nehanda, I want to ask one more question before we wrap today up. If you had one takeaway to share with our audience today, what would it be? Julie, let's start with you.

 

JULIE MARXEN: Power in small amounts. I love taking bit-sized pieces and showing the impact that it's going to have on the long run. I tell people this all the time. If you just start saving a little bit right now, in 30, 40 years, you're going to be astounded at the amount of compound growth. Again, there is so much power in that.

 

ALEX ROCA: Thank you for that, Julie. And Nehanda?

 

NEHANDA JULOT: I would say baby steps are monumental. The little bit, the incremental progress that we make, acknowledging that, and having that motivate us, I think, we need to embrace and give ourselves grace and celebrate those milestones along the way.

 

ALEX ROCA: Absolutely. For me, it was about automation. Whether we're trying to make sure that our bills are paid on time or that we're saving at a regular interval, make sure that you automate whatever it is that you're trying to do. That way, when life gets in the way, we don't forget those important steps as well. So Julie, Nehanda, this was wonderful. Thank you so much for chatting with me and for all of the great information that you've shared today. We're also going to have a slide. I think it just went up. That's going to have all of our upcoming events and to remind you on how you can get help. And to all of you watching, thank you for joining. We'll hopefully see you again on the 17th. We hope you have a wonderful day. Thank you.